...to Dazeychic (and to anyone else who might want to read):
Thank you for taking the time to comment on my journal. I usually don't leave replys back in my journal but from time to time will email someone if they ask a question or leave a thought provoking comment. However, this time I feel compelled to so that others who may have misunderstood my motivation for writing my Clique entry, might understand better.
I get the impression from what you've said that you are taking my entry personally. My entry was not a response to what you or Nikki wrote. It was an answer to Andrea's question, if I thought there were Cliques in J-land and my feelings regarding the matter. If you read it again, you'll see that it wasn't a direct response to your feelings. As a matter of fact, I specifically stated that I didn't leave comments on your journals because I didn't want to negate the feelings you two were sharing. I even gave the thesis of my writing when I said "each time I feel the same sense of ire boil in my soul. I've tried to evaluate why it evokes this emotion" - "So why does the use of the word offend me so? Because it's a victim word and a finger pointing word. It's a word that is so easily used but takes no responsibility."
You're not the first person to mention Cliques. In my entry I was exploring why the word evoked such a strong emotion in me and how someone might take responsibility for their feelings when they did use the word. I was sharing what life lessons I have learned regarding the matter. Your statement in your journal and in your response in my journal mentioned specifically me referencing comments. "Im not quite sure how some got the impression I was talking about comments in my own journal...because I would never say that. Dont get me wrong, I loooove comments here...but that wasn't the issue." I am making the assumption that the "some" you refer to here, is me. My mentioning comments in my entry was an extension of my reference to comments on my journal being ego-boosting, but not why I write. After all, you weren't the journaler who mentioned me having twenty comments. And, once again, it wasn't the first time in J-Land I heard mention of how many comments someone gets or doesn't. I was addressing my feelings on comments and if that was important to someone what they could do to rectify the matter. Because all of us have different motivations for writing our journals. I don't judge someone for wanting comments. It's not my place to make judgements on someone's motivation for writing, or their feelings regarding something.
I do, however, ask someone to take responsibility for their feelings. And, that is why I stated this: "What about those that you have ignored who have reached out to you? Not everyone will be responsive but don't take it personally. Maybe their life is full at the moment and they've got all they can handle." Often times, what someone feels is a result of what's going on inside of them and they should look at themselves, and give the other person the benefit of the doubt.
I find it amusing that this is the first time you have been by my journal, especially after expressing your feelings about cliques in J-Land. You see, I've been reading your journal for quite some time. I've even left comments there, but you have never responded to me, or acknowledged my presence. I decided to go back and see just how many messages I have left in your journal. I am including them here:
Shelli ... I hope you don't mind but I linked to this article in my journal. I wanted to write about what I think of this and trust in general. Stop by if you want. But most of all don't let this get you down. You're not being paranoid -- you were wise in what you did. http://journals.aol.com/krobbie67/RobbiesRantsRaves/
Comment from krobbie67 - 11/15/03 1:30 AM
That's just the sweetest thing. I feel like such a voyeur ~ okay so I'm not a voyeur. What is it when I'm listening? I'm not an eavesdropper because you posted it for me to hear. mmmh I'll be pondering that one all day. :-) Love your journal. I get a burst of energy everytime I stop by.
Comment from krobbie67 - 11/26/03 7:53 AM
It's a couple of miles away but I live near George Clooney. Well, actually probably a lot of other people too, after all it is L.A. But, where I hike goes right past Georgie's house. I'm like you though, I'd never tell. woops is that what I just did mmh?
Comment from krobbie67 - 11/30/03 12:17 AM
Your age belies you. You are wise beyond your years.
Comment from krobbie67 - 12/8/03 11:00 AM
Happy Birthday!!! And, what a wonderful trip your mind's wandering took me on. Thanks. ---Robbie
Comment from krobbie67 - 1/6/04 11:11 PM
I never felt ill will for you not replying. I figured maybe you had been by my journal and felt you couldn't relate to me since I am so much older and my topics consisted of different topics then you might be interested in. Or, maybe your plate is full and you just didn't have time for me. You see, I didn't take it personally, and I didn't think you were being "cliquey"
Based on your entry yesterday, it seems you have felt exactly that when you went to other journals, "I feel like I shouldn't comment in "cliquey" journals. Like, I dont fit in their group so why should I even say anything? Silly questions like, well, am I wasting my time investing in this person? Or Am I saying something that doesn't fit in properly. Does my comment even matter?" It's sad that you feel that way. But, it's not that journalers fault or responsibility for what you feel. Your feelings are your own, and you should own them. It makes me feel like you are trying to control the actions and motivations of people in J-land. What gives you the right? There are journals out there about topics that I can't relate to and/or don't feel comfortable leaving a comment on. Do I hold that journaler responsible for my feelings. No. It's their piece of the cyber-worldto do with as they see fit.
You further condemn other journalers by stating the following: "but if your journal is one of the few that ooze with popularity-contest-type-mentality...you must own up to that." It seems to me you are pointing your finger at people and still have three pointing back at you. After all, you have a list with the heading "Journals to Envy" on your website and a link for "Awards and Recognition." I would think that oozes a bit of the "popularity-contest-type-mentality." I guess ultimately what I'm trying to say is that I'm sorry you feel the way you do, but each person's journal is their own, just like our feelings are our own. Do not judge. Carve a niche for yourself in this world and enjoy yourself.
To steal a line from Freee: "Follow the love."
23 comments:
Well, as an outsider to this discussion, I would just like to add that it would never even occur to me to be reluctant to comment in a journal if I felt I had a legitimate comment to make. Also, I don't understand how someone's journal can make you feel like you're not worthy to comment. I haven't come across ANY journals that made me feel that way--and if anything, I think journalers sincerely welcome comments from the people who take the time to stop by and read. Just my 2 cents...
OMG! Robbie I was JUST about to do an entry on the same thing! EXCELLENT! It IS a victim word! Well said! And how exactly is this clique crap supposed to work anyway? The very idea of something like that being able to work in J-Land is ludicrous! And everyone who's every cried "clique" has never been able to back up that statement with anything other than referencing their feelings. No concrete examples at all. And like you said, they need to own their own feelings. I'll also echo what Karen just said as well. I've seen nothing in J-Land but the OPPOSITE of this type of behavior--and people who feel insecure for whatever reason pointing fingers at others who may seem "more popular" than they are. Bottom line: who cares?!?!? Journaling isn't a popularity contest. And we're all too old & life is too short to waste time fretting over the acceptance of others. JMO :-)
Gregg
To be honest with you -- I didn't realize that people read my journal that much -- all those visitors I thought were mostly from me accessing it from other places during the day lol -- ANYWAY, my entry on cliques was based on something else that happened as well, something that burns me to this day and that I wish not to bring up again -- so pretty much, if you knew about that - you would understand the fire in my entry. I appreciate you writing in your journal discussing both sides, and I know that it wasn't a direct response to my feelings because there is no way that you know about what happened -- its all good though :)
I just got to reading your journal after being away for a few days. Just what the heck is going on here? From what I read, you made a perfectly great entry with just how you felt and that should have been respected as how you felt. I never realized that people were forming Cliques, I know them as friends but friends are always welcome in my life. Like you, I choose not to judge for I feel it's not my right. I must say that I always enjoy it when you stop by and leave a comment, It is noticed and appriciated but then are all comment good and bad. Hugs Lanny
I just got here and now I have to go find the entry everyone is talking about.
I like comments. It's nice to know someone is reading. And, it also helps me find other journals. : ) As for cliques, I guess I'm out of the loop. : )
hmm...I think that was quite a lashing. And I'm not so sure it was deserved. You're contradicting yourself as well Robbie, even though you don't see it at all. I think some of it lies in the fact that you're friends with the cliquey folks...even though you're not trying to be part of a "clique" or disclude anyone. That's just how it is. I IMed with Shelli last night and I know for a fact her comments weren't directed at you...and I'm sorry to see that you took offense. Both of you are friends of mine though. And I was just about to reply to your e-mail Robbie when I saw this. I probably won't reply now. I'll probably post. We'll see.
And definitely "Follow the love.." but make sure it's real love...by real genuine folks...not ones that are just putting on a show.
Before this spirals out of control (and I'm sure this is all MY fault since I'm the one who posed the original question after seeing Shelli's Journal), I want to say something.
Robbie, if I was brave enough to write about my feelings in a public journal and someone *tongue-in-cheek* referred to those feelings as a green eyed monster, I'd feel hurt, too. Sure, it's a risk you take when you share your thoughts at large. And maybe you WEREN'T talking directly to Shelli, but most everyone who responded knew that she was one of the people I was referring to. Certainly Shelli knew. And ... I'd hate to see her get the third degree for this on top of everything else.
Last, these *perceived* feelings of who done who wrong are a matter of personal interpretation. When I saw Shelli's comment about how she couldn't understand why anyone would feel she was talking about the amount of comments she received in her journal, I thought she was indirectly referencing MY comment in her journal.
It's really all a matter of interpretation. And at this point, maybe better suited for e-mail so we don't all start lining up against each other.
Shoot, I did want to say that you've made some good points, Robbie. This is one of those issues we could all debate till Kingdom Come. Or, until we got sick and tired of talking about it.
:-)
Pt. 3 ::sigh:: This conversation is exhaustive. It's unfair to focus on the fact that certain journalers gets lots of comments, without recognizing what goes on "behind the journal scenes" - meaning the chats, the personal emails, the constant reading and commenting that those journalers do! The friendships built! It takes work and it's supposed to be fun!
For the record, I'm open to anyone who shows that they're interested in being a part of my life in AOL-J. That's all I can say.
Pt. 2: I'm not stupid. I know I get a lot of comments, compared to some others. But half of the comments I get are my OWN responses to my commenters. I don't think of comments as an ego-boost, but as a form of interaction. I try not to leave anyone out. And I try like heck to get to everyone's journals, but I refuse to feel guilty that there aren't 45 hours in the day and 12 days in the week. That's unreasonable to ask.
Pt. 1: Robbie - I'm afraid this isn't a fight you can win. But you've put up a good fight. And I, for one, am glad you were brave enough to say something. Because it IS a personal attack on a nameless group who can't defend themselves. I'm pretty sure I'm part of that group, but I can't be sure, because no one named names. But I find all that hurtful because I've also left numerous comments in these girl's journals, with no response. I've exchanged emails with some of them and IM's. I never got the impression that I was being "unavailable" to them. And if I did, I'd like a personal email about it.
Robbie...thank you for your recent kindness in my journal....I've been having a time.
I sent you an email regarding this subject. What I find very interesting and I'll post it here, there is an underlaying current of dissention in J-Land. NO, you have not caused any of it!!! Amy, (Slomo), is right. Many, and I mean many, relationships have crossed from J-land to real life, not that anything that is written in journals isn't real with the exception of few. Bottom line, yes, I think there are people who are indeed jealous and envious. WHY!?? I agree, take ownership of your feelings and your wants in life. NO ONE can make you feel bad without your permission!
This is not directed towards any one individual. Just an observation of someone who indeed lives life. I have a keen sense of things that go beneath the surface.
Again, a general statement. Be Grateful and Be Yourself. Life is too fricking short as it is! Live the moment!!!!
Penny
OK I'm starting my own clique now. It's only for people who still live in the 80's and you must have a jean jacket with a Journey logo on the back. If you dont fit this then I can't hang with you.
lol!
:)
chris
ps- you know what I say Robbie, f 'em, f 'em all.
Really, it doesn't matter because Like I said before, I really am happy to see your take on the subject... And although there is no real end to such a drastic subject I can tell you that I honestly appreciate and respect your views.
~Shelli
This entry was unnecessarily aimed at me...I certainly didn't take your whole entry personally! I guess next time you shouldn't assume...you should ask me directly instead of posting for everyone to comment. Was it my reaction/answer you wanted or was it everyone else's?
continues below..
Well, I really am shocked to see my name blasted at the top of your journal like that!? If I remember correctly I said I was happy to see you comment about the topic! And the only thing I took badly was the green-eyed analogy. How could I not take that to heart? To say that someone's feelings are based on some fabricated envy?
As if I wouldn't take offense to that?
continues below...
Well said Robbie. Eloquent. Articulate. Clear. I respect you for so many reasons but specifically, for your willingness to use your forum to speak your truth. They say a group/community is only as strong as its weakest link. Thank you for showing up in your power. I honor that in you. And yeah, go where the love is!
Damn... I needs me a jean jacket with a Journey logo on it. ::sigh:: tehehehe..
I was gone for a few days and came back to a little controversy in AOL-J. I don't think anybody meant any harm, they were just expressing their thoughts, feelings and opinions--and this goes for you Robbie, I thought this was a well articulated entry--in their journals, and isn't that what journaling is all about? I think it's better that all these thoughts came out in the open so they can be addressed.
Hello Robbie,
Thank you so much for putting a link to my web site at your journal. I appreciate your kindness greatly!
My daughter has a journal and is exactly your age. She expresses her thoughts openly, honestly and from her heart, which is what a journal is all about. You remind me allot of Christina. Keep up the excellent writing! Respectfully yours, Tamara@artisticmurals.com
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